Bcst & Bcfc

[Rick]

BCST board members now hold monthly meetings with Bradford City representatives.

Attending the meeting on 14th November were Julian Rhodes and Wendy Kestin from Bradford City and Paul Spivey, Cath Tomlinson, and Robert Shimmin, representing BCST.

The main points of the meeting are as follows:

• Ladies’ Toilets: The ladies’ and men’s toilets have been thoroughly steam-cleaned and it is hoped that the stadium cleaners will now keep them in a clean condition.

• Band: BCST needs to find some volunteer musicians.

• Match-day Transport: Charlton Athletic charges £5 return and advance booking is needed with the club. Each fan is collected from their own door. They always run at least one coach; sometimes more according to demand. It is thought that the bus fare from Bradford Interchange to Valley Parade is 60p and that there is a 10 minute service. About 4 years ago there was a public transport survey. The club will investigate further.

• Banner Display: Safety Office, Chris Patzelt, has confirmed that there are no problems provided that the banners have a Fire Certificate under Health and Safety Regulations and that he is notified in advance. Anyone interested in bringing a banner into the ground should ring the Clubline and ask for the Safety Officer.

• TL Dallas stand: There are a number of issues to consider in opening the TL Dallas to home fans. These include the extra policing costs and the upset caused to home fans if they are forced to relocate from Yorkshire First to accommodate away fans (Yorkshire First has 947 season ticket holders, up from 822 last season). Mr Rhodes is reluctant to make long-term offers to entice fans to sit in TL Dallas, when this may only take existing full-price fans from other areas, however he agreed to try home fans in TL Dallas and away fans in the Bradford end of Yorkshire First for 2 games in the New Year, where the number of expected away fans was low. This will enable a risk assessment to be performed. Thought needs to be given as to who is encouraged into TL Dallas stand and under what offers.

• Mr Rhodes agreed that in future, fans moved from their normal seats in the Midland Road will simply produce their ticket on the day, to secure their new seat in the upper tier of the Sunwin Stand. The fans obviously will not have a booked seat in these circumstances.

• Renaming the Bantams’ Bar was discussed. Renaming would involve costs in signs, directions and advertising. If people really wanted it, Mr Rhodes would be prepared to give the idea some consideration.

• The music and microphone volumes still need addressing. The club will review who “takes the microphone.” Interestingly, the Performing Rights licence costs around £8,000pa

• The club is having some 2007 calendars produced. They may be offered for sale in Asda’s foyer.


It's all well and good addressing these issues but the same complaints that come up on here day in day out aren't brought up.

Who cares if they want to rename the bantams bar or put a fecking band together, there are more important issues at hand.

[king billy]

You keep going on about "your AGM" - how many people were there?....
Serious question - wondering how many people it takes to ask a question you think is representative of ALL of Bradford Citys support!

Sounds to me like ONE PERSON had the idea of changing the Bantams Bar name - do you think its worthwhile taking up JR's time in asking a rediculous question that only 1 person thinks is a good idea? When there are more pressing questions supporters want answering.....

One of the reasons the trust won't ever work and will never be accepted by the mainstream support is because it doesn't or never has had the bollocks to ask real questions - like...

"Can you confirm categorically whether Todd has a contract till 2009 or is it a rolling one"?

"How many more defeats before you consider sacking Todd"

"Are you not worried that Todd publicly slags off the fans"

"Are you not worried that by franchising out the catering and club shop that we are no longer have any assets worth investing in"....

I could go on and on - but knowing how you work i know you'll keep asking the important stuff - like what colour table cloths 1 fan wants, and how soft 1 fan in the yorkshire first stand wants the toilet roll etc etc.....


http://bcafc.livewwware.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=13881&start=15

Quite an interesting thread that the resident Trust BNP voting wino is attempting to defend.....

[beerbantam]

Who do the trust represent?:rolleyes:

Power hungry arse licking mf's if you ask me!!

[Rick]

I saw him trying to explain their actions to parader on the OMB and thats what prompted me to post it on here.

They are probably granted the meeting on the condition they don't ask certain questions.

Before the meeting JR hands them a sheet of questions they are allowed to ask such as colour of napkins, positioning of programme sellers and the flavour of sweets the citygent hands out.

[baldbantam]

A couple of points:

1 Unless you're a member of the Trust, your opinion means diddly squat. The Trust represents it's members, not just any City fan, and as such it asks the questions that it's members have put forward. If you want to have a say in what those questions are then you should be joining the Trust, not carping from the sidelines.

2 This type of meeting can never be about the football management side of things. It isn't for that, and it is an unreasonable expectation that it ever would be. These meetings are purely for discussion of logistical questions and to give fans input in to those. It's better to have fan input in to a limited range of issues than to have no fan input at all.

[BantamMenace]

so are they defo doin the symphony stand thing where home fans sit in there?

[tony d]

A couple of points:

1 Unless you're a member of the Trust, your opinion means diddly squat. The Trust represents it's members, not just any City fan, and as such it asks the questions that it's members have put forward. If you want to have a say in what those questions are then you should be joining the Trust, not carping from the sidelines..


Who could ever of thought that BB????

You have to be in it to have a say...

Does that happen in society elsewhere or is this a relatively new thing????

PMSFL.... I'm sure you will get many answers telling you you're wrong mate but that's quite funny cheers...

[Yeadon Bantam]

It's taken me nearly 3 years to get the club to try teh Bradford End thing :(

It was my idea ages ago!

[beerbantam]

It's taken me nearly 3 years to get the club to try teh Bradford End thing :(

It was my idea ages ago!


When it reopens it will be known as the 'Igloo end' as a tribute to you Aimee!

[ChuckleBantam]

A couple of points:

1 Unless you're a member of the Trust, your opinion means diddly squat. The Trust represents it's members, not just any City fan, and as such it asks the questions that it's members have put forward. If you want to have a say in what those questions are then you should be joining the Trust, not carping from the sidelines.

2 This type of meeting can never be about the football management side of things. It isn't for that, and it is an unreasonable expectation that it ever would be. These meetings are purely for discussion of logistical questions and to give fans input in to those. It's better to have fan input in to a limited range of issues than to have no fan input at all.

"Why are you ripping fans off with an all round sub standard product for high standard prices, why don't you give a **** about it and why do you continue to do so?"

Now, as far as I can see, that's not a football management related question, but I will guarantee that the Trust doesn't have the Balls to ask Junior for an answer. If the membership are daft enough to fork out their fees for such non representation from the wannabees, then that's their hard lines. I personally wouldn't pay a subscription to an organisation that's as much use as a chocalte fireguard.

I can just see these meetings now;

Junior, Jim & the gang; Any Questions?

Trusty Pete; Yes, can we hurry up? Man Yoo's Champion's League Game is on the Telly tonight!

[Macca Ha Ha Ha]

or "why don't we stock my favourite crisps at VP Julian?"

There are some decent people who help run the BCST - but what are they trying to acheive? - SF where are ya pal?

[Devil's Advocate]

I'm here, Wisey, and I think BB says it all. Absolutely right. If you want the issues that are discussed on here dealt with at the meetings then join the Trust and lobby the Board. If you think we are all wishy-washy wet fish then keep slagging us off. Chuckle, I have some bollocks mate, unfortunately if I asked such questions I am absolutely certain that any answers I got would be subject to commercial confidentialities or at the least would be offered off the record.

The thing with this is people have an idea of what they expect the Trust to be and that is a long way from what it can be at the moment. It can ask those questions if you want and if that is fed through in the right way but it is unlikely to get honest answers from the Chairman and is more likely to ruin its relationship with the Chairman than get anything you guys can get your teeth into. Whatever you think about the Chairman or the way the BCISC etc have been treated at least the Trust is still knocking on doors and still has dialogue. If you don't like the tone of the dialogue, join (it only costs a fiver) and influence the issues that the Trust Board should have at the head of their priorities.

Thanks for listening, I am steeling myself for the usual onslaught from those who have exactly the same hopes as me but can't bring themselves to be associated with something called a "Trust", probably because one of the Board members was once a Man Utd fan, despite the effort he has put in voluntarily for his fellow City fans with no reward and in the face of much adversity and criticism. Tell you what, I'm sure Richmond was a City fan before he came to Bradford - in fact I remember standing next to the fat get on the Kop! ;)

[Tarty]

A couple of points:

1 Unless you're a member of the Trust, your opinion means diddly squat. The Trust represents it's members, not just any City fan, and as such it asks the questions that it's members have put forward. If you want to have a say in what those questions are then you should be joining the Trust, not carping from the sidelines.


Just to stick my thoughts in. When the trust was set up it was to try and save the club correct? Now the trust state that they "represent the fans". Now what they are saying is "we will only ask certain questions "if" you pay us". Anyone remember the Cash for Questions that MP's were getting into crap for?

Yes the trust should ask the club questions that the fans need answering, but not just the questions that give money to the trust, but general fans views as well. Look at the state of the catering at the moment, your telling me that will only be sorted out if we give money to the trust?

[Devil's Advocate]

No, Pob, perhaps you should look into what the Trust have been asking. If you were a member matbe you'd know. They are working with the Club as well as Shipley Bantams and Shelf Bantams on addressing issues related to catering. They have also addressed issues relating to toilet facilities. But best to ignore that eh? It isn't cash for questions but the Trust can only be truly representative of its members. It can try to be broadly representative but then it will be slated for actually only being truly representative of a small bunch of fans eh? Let's stick to slagging it off, it's easier.

[Tarty]

So if the trust is this "wonderful thing", explain why when the BCISC was up and running the BCISC did more for the club than the trust did. The sham of a Xmas draw was all down to the club piss balling around. How come the club never went to the trust?

Don't get me wrong, the trust might have changed and be more friendlier than before, but do the trist go "to the fans", because from what I can see at the moment the fans have to go to the trust. Surely it should be the other waya around

[baldbantam]

I'm not knocking the BCISC, but the Trust was instrumental in the activities that went towards raising £250,000 a few years ago. True they didn't do it all, or even possibly most of it, but they did a hell of a lot towards it and I don't recall anything on a similar scale from the BCISC.

[Devil's Advocate]

Thanks, BB. I rest my case. Pob, did the BCISC come to you as a non-member and ask you for your views, did they just ask the questions that were raised on the websites, were they influenced by the often over-hyped issues on these messageboards? Take a good look at yourself first and then criticise people who try their best to make things better at the Club in a constructive way by doi8ng something through a legally sound, well-established organisation as is the Trust. Easy to criticise it when things aren't perfect, but at least it is trying to make a difference, however small that may be.

[Devil's Advocate]

BTW, a fiver? Not a lot if you really want to see if it can make a difference. If not, carry on as you are. I'm sure it will make a great deal of difference to the way Julian Rhodes thinks.

[Tarty]

But the difference between the BCISC and the trust is that the BCISC actually went to the fans. They took onboard what people were saying, both members and non members. You didn't see the trust standing in the stands talking to the fans, members or non members.

I am not slating what the trust do. But I am going by what BB said

Unless you're a member of the Trust, your opinion means diddly squat. The Trust represents it's members, not just any City fan

Maybe that might be a valid point, but the trust are meant to be representing the fans, should it really matter if your a member or not? You don't really see trust events been advertised. Surely if the trust wanted more members then they would be trying to organise more and more events to try and get more members.

Don't get me wrong, the trust might be trying to do good things

[Yeadon Bantam]

For what it's worth the shippers had the idea of meeting emc not the shitty trust!

[king billy]

For what it's worth the shippers had the idea of meeting emc not the shitty trust!


Spot on - the meeting was set up by Stu (Shipleybantams) it had nothing whatsoever to do with the trust - they just hijacked it at a later date.....

If you actually look at the figures i'd be so bold as to state that it was the Telegraph & Argos that raised most and did most in helping to "save City".....the trust were the only fans group at the time - hence the reason why people joined and supported them - don't kid yourselves that it was for any other reason than that - the size of their membership now speaks volumes to how people really feel!!.....the Shippers and Shelf membership is much bigger and they're only small groups, and they aren't supported by huge organisations like Supporters Direct!!!

[tony d]

Great thread this...

Who would of thought that people would slag off something on this site and take the piss out of something they are not privy to less threads and news letters.

Without joining said band of brothers or paying to be members or sitting in a chaired meeting with those very same people...

Im just glad this is a one off SFB...

So easy to sit behind your computer and slag em off for your own jollies...Now as far as i was aware the Trust is a members club type affair..

You know a club where like minded folk go to enjoy themselves in the knowledge that by being a member they get to voice their concerns as paying in fan members to the board...

Now whether this is to ask if JR can stack new toilet paper in the loos instead of the cheapo wipe and smear stuff or to ask why the stewards are such Nazis... It is up to them and their little band of merry men...

Surely before crying you should going by the new rules of this site actually all(not one of you) ALL join and voice your concerns even try to get on the pabel that visits for these meetings...

Have i missed something here...Ahhh yes it is because others are involved in their own little clubs and things.... Best not mention the knitting circle again...Never visited that either but strangely that was deemed funny...

In summary...The trust do what thier members want them to do..If you are not a part of it and think things should change then going by recent advice i reckon you should get off your arses and join or leave SFB alone eh!!!

Nicew one .. Jingle bells and all that...tup:

[Yeadon Bantam]

Thanks for that Tone!

Anyway as we were before tony sidetracked the whole bloody thread again!

The trust hi jacked the meetings and even dared steal all the thunder away from the 2 Great Steve and Stu who a fantastic job.


The trust said the idea was theirs? :D o how we ****ing laugh at the pathetic ones!

[tony d]

Why do you lot turn every thread into a "it's your fault" thread...

This thread is about people moaning that the Trust doesn't do this or that is it not...

My stance is if you have a beef, join the Trust and make it as a paid up member...

Seemingly quite easy when faults are brought out to just blame me for doing the pointing....

Stop nit picking at me and learn the differences i keep pointing out to you...

I'm sick of seeing two facedness on here on nearly every thread by the same people doing the same things....Who then take the now easy option of blaming me...

This thread is about the Trust Adie not about you moaning at me...I'm sticking to your rules now so as not to offend and guess what it still does....Strange that.....


Which part of Join the trust and earn the right to complain about the questions and track they take instead of moaning from the outside looking in whilst not even being a member do you think i have wrong here...

[Kop Kred]

The basis of any supporters organisation/group be it a trust or supporters group is the well bieng of the club and it's fans… said groups should not be inward looking at only the needs and suggestions of it's paid membership but to the 'club' as a whole, which includes the common fan.
Paid up members should receive benefits of course, primarily voting rights but also discounts on functions and social events organised for fun or fund raising.
But let's not forget we are all investors in Bradford City in respect of the money we fork out for matches, refreshments and goods and without us there would be no club… so what I'm saying I guess is if you want to create an organisation using the 'supporters' banner than you should cater for the requirements of the majority... not the minority. otherwise call it the 'Bradford City Trust without portfolio'.

[tony d]

Tell that to the Unions then.....

Back in the day if you were not a Union man you were nothing....

The Trust is set up as far as i am aware to cater for the needs of all fans...But to have a voice you have to make that extra commitment of becoming a paid member...

Now anyone can be a Bradford City fan anywhere in the world but to watch em and sample the full matchday experience you have to make that extra commitment to pay on the door....

Does that sound right???

The Trust would have a lot more power as other clubs will vouch if everyone or a large slice of fans joined...

Even the ones who don't go anymore...

If the trust had more members than fans who watch City, then at these meeting when the guys asked to meet with the chairman started to voice these concerns we all have re service and entertainment on the pitch, value for money etc they would then and only then hold a lot more credibility...

Changes would have to be made as the club would see the fan power that really keeps the club in business revolting and changes at some levels would defo happen..

At the moment who is going to listen to a few, whilst the rest remain either quiet or just slate the Trust for being useless????

If i was JR and read the stuff about the Trust from people not even arsed to join it i would make sure i had the upper hand and left them only the Toilet roll questions to ask each meeting...

[Kop Kred]

Tell that to the Unions then.....

Back in the day if you were not a Union man you were nothing....

The Trust is set up as far as i am aware to cater for the needs of all fans...But to have a voice you have to make that extra commitment of becoming a paid member...

Now anyone can be a Bradford City fan anywhere in the world but to watch em and sample the full matchday experience you have to make that extra commitment to pay on the door....

Does that sound right???

The Trust would have a lot more power as other clubs will vouch if everyone or a large slice of fans joined...Even the ones who don't go anymore...If the trust had more members than fans who watch City then at these meeting when the guys asked to meet with the chairmen to voice these concerns would hold a lot more credability...

At the moment who is going to listen to a few whilst the rest reamin quiet or just slate the Trust for being useless????

I'm not slating it... it did Ok as a fund raisng mechanism when it was needed but if it want's to run as a supporters organisation it shpould be looking at the needs of the majority.

[tony d]

I'm not slating it... it did Ok as a fund raisng mechanism when it was needed but if it want's to run as a supporters organisation it shpould be looking at the needs of the majority.

The Majority should join it if they want change but they will not..Easier to slate from the outside.... The lack of members ensures it is a doomed entity...
Who's fault is that..Surely not the Trusts but the people who find the time to read about everything it does and then nit pick it...

Stand up and be counted or do better yourself (generic yourself not you personally)is the way i see this TC..

[Devil's Advocate]

I hate to get really deeply involved in these matters but just to answer at least one point.

King Billy, yes it was the T&A who received the most donations during the Save Our City campaign, probably because they are a big media organisation and jumped on the bandwagon knowing full well it made good business sense to be at the forefront of the fund raising campaign. However, they did not initiate it, that was done by the Trust on Thursday the 13th May at the request of the Administrators. It was the following day after the fans had pledged nearly 12,000 on the night that the T&A provided 10,000 and then started "their" Save Our City campaign. To dismiss the actions of the Trust at the time as hardly worth it is folly. Had we not started the ball rolling I doubt the T&A would have volunteered to be the organisers of the fundraising. For one they could hardly have had the meetings I had with Kroll etc for fear of conflict of interests. They simply had a better mechanism for getting the message out to people and those reading the T&A would no doubt have found it easier to donate through their channels. They also organised the fundraising match, which the Trust had mooted in the first place but did not have the resources to organise - how could the Trust compete with the contacts the T&A had and the human resources they ploughed into it. They were getting paid to do it as well.

Twilight, you make a great point and I would support that any group acting in the best interests of fans should take into account the representative views of all fans as far as is reasonably practicable. As others have mentioned though the most vocal views are on messageboards, yet these represent a very small minority of the fanbase. The Trust should act in the interests of its members first and foremost but seek ways of getting a more representative view whenever real issues are to be investigated.

Yeadon or Twunt, whatever your name is now. You don't recall the Trust standing among the fans and asking them their views? What not even when I stood up on May 13th 2004 and said this Club is in the **** and you need to know and you have to help save it. Not even at the vigil in Centenary Square, not even at the various meetings and events that then occurred where I tried to get to as many as possible? You sure you don't ever remember the Trust standing among the fans? It isn't long since you were defending me about the fundraising and the worth of the Trust at that time. How quickly one forgets.

For what it's worth I think Steve and Stu do a fantastic job and add to that Colin et al at Shelf. Previously Ernie, King Billy, Parader, Wisey et al went way beyond the call of duty in being a City fan and I am genuinely disappointed that the ISC was so frustrated with apathy and the way it was treated that it ended up folding. Sometimes however I think this whole discussion gets clouded by a warped view that those involved with running the Trust are working to a different agenda to those who were involved and still areinvolved with the respective supporters' and travel clubs. The overriding objective has to be to take the Club forward and make it a better experience for the fans, whilst safeguarding against ever being in a situation like we were in 2004

Finally, in terms of hijacking schemes, I would hope this isn't intentional and has been misinterpreted. At the Trust AGM the Chairman made it clear that the Trust is working with Stu and Steve at Shippers and Colin at Shelf in taking the catering issues forward. I certainly heard it as he was crediting these guys for pursuing such matters and the Trust was acting as a support of such dialogue to improve the matchday experience. Stu and Steve I recall didn't seem to have any problem that night, and it is refreshing to speak to these guys at times. I know it can appear that the Trust gets treated differently by the Club, but that isn't necessarily the Trust's fault. What it can try to do is engage as many views as possible in its meetings with the Club and encourage dialogue with all relevant parties. It isn't a competition in my eyes.

[Jumbo]

Not a word....something about curry....












:D sorry couldnt resist....are people really reading all this??? :)

[Yeadon Bantam]

Yeadon or Twunt, whatever your name is now. You don't recall the Trust standing among the fans and asking them their views? What not even when I stood up on May 13th 2004 and said this Club is in the **** and you need to know and you have to help save it. Not even at the vigil in Centenary Square, not even at the various meetings and events that then occurred where I tried to get to as many as possible? You sure you don't ever remember the Trust standing among the fans? It isn't long since you were defending me about the fundraising and the worth of the Trust at that time. How quickly one forgets.



I wasn't criticising the trust saving city!


Just the new one stealing the shippers ideas....

[Devil's Advocate]

Ok, I think I answered that point as well.

[Jumbo]

Breath SFB......in and out....count to 10....1, 2, 3.....i wanna fcking get him roflmao:


:D only joking of course.... comp:

[Devil's Advocate]

I'm alright, TBB, I am managing my anger! tup:

[Yeadon Bantam]

Never once criticised the helping of saving our club Mark, like you said i defended you!

[Devil's Advocate]

I know, mate, I was just trying to set the record straight. tup:

[Yeadon Bantam]

Goooooooooooooooooooooooood! :D

[Macca Ha Ha Ha]

Apathy is still unfortunately rife amongst the City supporters - It's really hard to get something off the ground and build it - the one positive out of all City's financial woes was the establishment of the BCST / SHIPPERS / SHELF and IDL supporters groups - between them they probably represent some 10% of the current fanbase that stay loyal to the club - not a huge number i know but contrast that with the situation before when the old OSC dwindled and was ripped to pieces by controversy and certain people at the Club - and the club grew from success on the pitch alone.

The BCST certainly has a lot of different objectives and a different structure than the other groups but collectively they are a force and they do need to work together.

On a personal level i have made some good friendships out of these groups existence and the common theme is the unflinching support for Bradford City - not those running the show but the real fabric of the place, the people and the soul of the club.

For me it's essentially about ensuring a club for the younger generation of City fans, and also, as Stu McCall once said about those lost on May 11th 1985 - Any success we achieve is as much for the memory of those people as for those here today (or words to that effect).